Insultation to stop pipe noise

[MasterPlumbersKeymaster]

I have alot of pipe noise (sounds like pipes banging) which originates only once per day (happens to be 5am!) in the wall of my apt. I think it is water hammer, but they put on the arresters and no luck. All that my wall has in it is the drain pipes from the tub, sink, toilet, the pipes themselves run along my ceiling to the appliance. So, I don’t know if the noise is in my wall, or just “echoes” into the wall since it is awfully hollow. Everywhere you put your ear you’d swear that’s where the noise is.

Anyway, no luck, so they offered to put insulation in the wall. Could that help? Is that a solution when nothing else seems to work?

Thanks

[Retired plbg1Participant]

Sounds like your PVC pipe is expanding and contracting, if pipe is rubbing the wood then the insulation wont do any good, have to get in wall and make the pipe holes bigger are what ever, try and see if it works.

[nicktheplumberParticipant]

Water hammer is caused by the closing of a water supply valve to a fixture (tubs & sinks, washing machines, toilets, etc.). You describe a 5AM banging, and unless someone is using a fixture in your house at that time, I don’t think you can blame water hammer.

Hot water pipes can also make noise as hot water runs through them and heats them up. Again, unless someone is running hot water at 5AM, I can’t understand why this should be causing your problem.

Drain noise can occur when water is run through drains, but, again, why only at 5AM?

This leaves diurnal fluctuations in your supply pipe water pressure. One cause of pipe noise is excessive water line pressure. A pressure control valve inserted at the entrance of your water pipes into the basement may help.

In any case, loose pipes are the main cause of pipe noise, and the best way to prevent such noise is to secure all pipes solidly. This is obviously easier to do when the pipes are installed and not covered up in the finished walls.

NtP

[Robert Stephen MortonParticipant]

Nick. Years ago I found by accident that valve bounce was the single most cause of “hammer”.
I was on a job that a Hammerchewer or DIY had done & had run all the copper pipes hanging from the bearers with no clips. There was a horrible Hammer, so I solidly clipped the pipes by hanging 4×2 timber down to the pipes & clipped them. The hammer continued & after checking all open controll cocks found that by turning off the cistern cock the hammer vanished. hence We now use Ball Control valves & never have a problem except for jumper type taps – ceramic disc taps fix that problem.
Vibrations are a different thing though & clipping & Silicon will fix that.
Bob

[nicktheplumberParticipant]

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In reply to message posted by Robert Stephen Morton:
The hammer continued & after checking all open controll cocks found that by turning off the cistern cock the hammer vanished. hence We now use Ball Control valves & never have a problem except for jumper type taps – ceramic disc taps fix that problem.
Vibrations are a different thing though & clipping & Silicon will fix that.
Bob

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Morton,
I’m with you on that. Ball valves are definitely the way to go. I haven’t used either gate valves or throttling valves in any of my installations in the past 10 years (except in some commercial supply pipe installations with 2″ or greater lines where the gate valves are still considered “state of the art” (if only because ball valves in that size are hard to come by).

I still stand by my impression that improperly secured pipes and excessive water pressure are the main causes of “noisy pipes” in otherwize well-installed plumbing.

NtP

[turdchaserParticipant]

In my experience the number one cause has been the toilet ballcock. Sammy, check and make sure the valves inside the toilets shut off completely with the water level below the overflow tube. If it shuts off right at the top of the tube changes in pressure in the piping will cause the valve to flutter. You also stated that you are in an apartment all toilets should be checked for this.

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