- This topic has 6 replies, 3 voices, and was last updated 23 years, 3 months ago by
Harold Kestenholz.
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MasterPlumbers
During recent freeze, I lost 5 cast iron radiators and numerous pipes. Need assistance on replacing them and possible system upgrades. Any help would be greatly appreciated.
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If you are experiencing freezes often, antifreeze in water systems and the drain-back of steam systems can be an answer. Burnham Boiler makes replacement radiators.
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quote:
Originally posted by Harold Kestenholz:
If you are experiencing freezes often, antifreeze in water systems and the drain-back of steam systems can be an answer. Burnham Boiler makes replacement radiators.
WHOA there Partner, Just one-second there cow boy. You do know a lot of the boilers have that crap rubber/plastic seal instead of Quality steel push nipples.
This elastic “O” ring can fail when exposed to certain chemicals LORD KNOWS they fail enough on their own without the chemical additives to help them.
Certain anti freezes are NOT approved in hydronic heating as it will effect pump seals and if a leakage does occur we are now talking Toxic waste clean up.
What can be a very safe option is installing an INDOOR OUT DOOR thermostatic which will increase indoor temperature 1 degree for every 2 degree drop out side IN conjunction with non electric zone valves with the fail safe opening at 40 degree F. to prevent isolation and freeze ups.
There can even be a few Fusible plugs added like we do to protect acetylene tanks and boilers from Exploding.
There are a hundred options and ALL Chemical free.
Brine solution like we use in Central Absorption systems using a bronze impeller comes to mind as this is Natural and no toxic and CHEAP.
Harold thank you so much again for signing on the inner circle or the PIPDL
Where professions hang out at lunch time. -
This gentleman has had a freeze-up. This means that an indoor-outdoor controller would do nothing to help the paerson when power outage stops the heat. If the sugestion is not to use antifreeze; then steam heat in a nice below-ground, never-freeze basement is an alternative. Another is to use a boiler that is not affected by anti-freeze (like mine that sits outdoors all year.)
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I like that warning about using toxic automobile anitfreeze. Some people just see the word antifreeze and aren’t aware that etylene glycol is toxic and can harm the environment.
The anti-freeze professional plumbers use is propylene glycol that is often an ingredient in orange and other flavor sodas. Even so, the EPDM gaskets used as seals in some devices swells and fails from long exposure to glycols. EPDM is the same material used for electrical insulation and automobile window gaskets, but we don’t put antifreeze on them as a practice.
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quote:
Originally posted by Harold Kestenholz:
I like that warning about using toxic automobile anitfreeze. Some people just see the word antifreeze and aren’t aware that etylene glycol is toxic and can harm the environment.The anti-freeze professional plumbers use is propylene glycol that is often an ingredient in orange and other flavor sodas. Even so, the EPDM gaskets used as seals in some devices swells and fails from long exposure to glycols. EPDM is the same material used for electrical insulation and automobile window gaskets, but we don’t put antifreeze on them as a practice.
Harold WE both know a lot of folks go away either for vacation or leave the house un attended and lower the thermostat to dangerously low settings as to conserve fuel and hell with protection.
If there is an in door out door setting this home would protected in case of the “Human factor.”
Even steam is not a guarantee of a non freeze up as the some steam traps should never be exposed to freezing temperatures unlike the Thermo dynamic which is a fantastic trap But not suited for the lower pressures encountered in most residential systems.
About the ANTI Freeze many “professionals” are not aware of the various types that can be used.
EPDM by the way used in the roofing industry is subject to failures when most chemicals come in contact with them
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An indoor-outdoor control adjusts the water temperature in relation to the outdoor temperature, so as the outdoor temperature falls the water temperature rises so more heat is available from the radiation. I thought an explanation of what the control does might help the uninitiated. Parhaps Sylvan can explain how this would stop freezing the radiation in case of a power failure.
You would definitely want to install a steam system without traps so there would be none upstairs to be damaged. A carefully-installed one-pipe system or a two-pipe vapor system designed without traps would let the steam-created water drain back to the boiler. If the boiler is sitting under ground level on the ground in a closed basement, the chances of freezing the system are much less. This was very important in 1900 when people worked 12-hour days and couldn’t get to stoke the coal fire at times. It can be useful today.
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