- This topic has 15 replies, 8 voices, and was last updated 23 years, 8 months ago by
Frank Hiebert.
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Chris Johnstone
Now I am upset. Here I went and had a plaque made saying that I had reached the ultimate level, since Sylvan would not even let me go get his coffee, and now you have taken that honor away. I guess I will have to make it a rotating trophy to be sent to the latest receiver of Sylvan’s vitriole.
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Fourth Year, and Wallingford Plm+Htg.,
It seems like I ought to hold that trophy for a while, even though I am not a plumber, just a “BRAIN DEAD, DITCH DIGGER.” But, then again, maybe I do not deserve the trophy in light of the fact that Sylvan actually agreed with the advice that I recently gave to “Coach” regarding a groundwater problem under a new home that he was thinking of purchasing.
Sylvan did not even question my heritage in his response, nor did he suggest that I find another occupation because of my apparent, “BRAIN DEAD, DITCH DIGGING” incompetance. His advice only contained ONE sentence, and it was almost a complete, and gramatically correct sentence, with no misspelled words. AMAZING!!! But, of course, his sentence did not contain any punctuation.
Sylvan wrote:
>I agree with John RUN LIKE HELL<
Now that is scary! His response prompted me to read my advice to Coach again to see what I possibly could have said that was wrong. :>)
I was worried lately, that Sylvan had mellowed in his responses to several inquiries. He seemed to have actually answered the questions politely and briefly, actually understood the questions posted, and did not criticize the advice of others responding to the inquiries.
It was almost boring. But then, low and behold, along comes mdn39 with the posting of “New Plumbing”, and Sylvan could not resist the opportunity to insult, and disagree with Fourth Year, Wallingford Plm+Htg, Marty, racefanone, and me. A leopard cannot change his spots to stripes.
Now granted, mdn39 is an ungrateful twit, but he/she DID request that we all forget that the question was ever asked. Then Sylvan disregards that request, and launches a lengthy, vitriolic attack on Wallingford Plm+Htg, again misusing this GREAT MasterPlumbers.com forum. Loz, or his appointed board moderator, then put a lock on the thread.
Well, how about it Fourth Year, do I deserve to possess the traveling trophy or not. I have made a resolution to not respond to any of Sylvan’s taunts, and insults in the belief that everyone that reads his tripe recognizes his insecurity, his lack of grammatical skills, his lack of social skills, and his inability to even understand the questions asked or the purposes of this forum. JWA
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Back off john!!If fourth Year thinks that I should hold the trophy then we must respect his wishes.I have been verbaly abused alot lately.I will say that your insight into Sylvans insecurities are on the mark.At first I thought that Sylvan was just an angry man ,but now I’m convinced that he is a sick man.I think Sylvan has some of the plumbers and heaters afraid to answer postings for fear of being abused.I guess they will never get the trophy.
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Fourth Year, and Wallingford Plm+Htg,
Ok,OK,OK!!! It just makes me “angry” that Sylvan “threw me a bone” by agreeing with one of my responses. I am afraid he ruined my chances of ever holding that trophy. Damn!!
It is fruitless to respond to that mental midget, so I have decided to never address any of his ridiculous charges. I stated in a challenge post to Sylvan several months ago the following:
“For me to engage in a battle of wits with Sylvan Tieger, is like me dueling with an unarmed man.”
On another occasion, I paraphrased a line from a book by Bill Bryson, “A Walk in the Woods”, in regard to another of Sylvan’s mindless attacks.
“I have long known that it is part of God’s plan for me to spend a little time with each of the most stupid people on earth, and Sylvan Tieger is proof that even on the Internet, I will not be spared.”
I noticed that Loz deleted another of Sylvan’s lengthy, insulting responses to my response to fourth year’s original post. Way to go Loz, it appears that this is the only way to control this child. I wonder how much time he spent composing that diatribe. I had to chuckle when Loz did the right thing. Sylvan must be fuming!!! :>)
Hey, considering the abuse that Sylvan heaped upon me in that “briefly appearing attack”, it seems to me that I, in fact, should get another chance at the trophy. What do you think? JWA
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Lets hear from Plumber Bob.Bob who should get the trophy?
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Bob can only come out to play if Sylvan lets him.I’m sorry John but after reading the New Plumbing posting I think I deserve the trophy for at least a day.Was it just me or was there a little anger in Sylvans posting?My selfesteem has been ruind.I think I will create an imaginary friend to pat me on the back.
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Hi Guys:
It’s nice to see Sylvan, aka Bob, get slammed every now and then.I enjoy it as much as the next fellow. It doesn’t take much to hit Sylvan’s “hot buttons”. Like a lot of other plumbers, I get a little tired of his insults, long-winded, boring diatribes and his own self importance. But what really erkes me is the fact that he’s been able to carry on in such a sick manner for so long on this site. For that I blame the webmasters, especially Lorenzo himself. Apparently, Sylvan is a regular columnist contributor to this site, so indirectly he does represent this site(and not doing a very good job at it, Sylvan). Yet he carries on like some know-it-all A-hole. His actions have turned a number of regular contributors away from this site and quite frankly, I’m hesitate to post my advice to a lot of questions for fear I might have to be subjected to Sylvan’s Bile-spewing backlash. The last thing I need is to get into a pissing match with this Jerk. Look how many times a person will post a simple question and it’ll turn into a childish pissing match between Sylvan and his “victim”. It makes us (professional, skilled tradesmen)look like jerks in the eyes of the folks who come to this site for advice.How sad! What a disgrace!What has this site done to correct the problem? NOTHING!.What should be done? If it was up to me,I would have read the riot act to Sylvan a long, long time ago. Either he cleans up his act or he’s outa here. Let’s face it, despite his MANY shortcommings, he does know his stuff. I just don’t need to read “War and Peace” whenever he posts a reply.Nor do I need to be belittled by him as well. Sure it’s entertaining stuff, but it doesn’t add a damn thing to the original posting.I find that I come to this site not to learnand better myself as a Plumber but rather to follow the continuing,sad soap opera: As Sylvan’s World Turns. Perhaps this site could develop a chatsite where plumbers/gasfitters could go to at predetermined times to have it out, so to speak. But due to time zones, that could be difficult, I suppose. Lorenzo, get your act together and set some guidelines for the posters! Just taking this opportunity to vent my opinions, everyone. Thanks all! Marty (from the Great White North) -
Short message to Sylvan:
My previous post will probably fall onto deaf ears, Sylvan. Sir,there’s no doubt that you do know your stuff. I’m sure, in person, your probably a nice guy. You may even have a wife and kids who love you and even a dog that likes you. Would it be so hard for you to be a “Mensch”(a man) once in awhile, instead of a “Schmuk” all the time?? No reply is necessary, just consider it. Marty -
Marty,
If you, and everyone else that Sylvan attacks would just ignore him, he will get bored, and perhaps, go away. As far as him being a “nice guy?”
Will Rogers never met Sylvan Tieger!!! JWA
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John: Easier said than done. Sylvan’s attacks are unprovoked. A regular poster will reply to a query, and if Sylvan doesn’t agree with the advice, the insults (ie: Stumblebums) and other nonsence spews forth. One last thing. In the “Important Notice” window it states: Any posts that are offensive/slanderous or are an attack on another user, will be removed from the bullitin boards.
If that was truly the case, we’d see a lot less of Sylvans antics. -
Marty, I find it very easy to just ignore personal, unprovoked attacks from folks that are obviously quite ignorant. I think that most intelligent people also recognize this level of ignorance, and also recognize the insecurity that is displayed. I personally do not care about the opinions of those that are not intelligent enough to see these attacks for what they are.
I am more concerned about the patently incorrect advice that Sylvan provides to people with questions about septic systems, an area of plumbing with which he has limited knowledge. For example, Sylvan once advised a man to install a steel septic tank, as a replacement tank for his system. Virtually every on-site sewage treatment system regulation code in the USA specifically prohibits the use of steel septic tanks.
Another area of concern is the misuse of the bulletin board as a soap box to promote other issues that have nothing to do with plumbing, like gun control, and other political issues.
I have spoken with Loz on the telephone, and communicated via e-mail with him about Sylvan’s personal style, and his abuse of the forum. He expressed frustration in dealing with Sylvan, and has spoken with him about discontinueing his insulting antics. Sylvan, however, thinks that he is humorous, and doesn’t realize that a vast majority of the people that read his crap, do not appreciate his acidic, New York humor.
Loz has been much more diligent in policing the bulletin boards lately. He owns several other websites, is committed to his large family, and was until recently, operating a plumbing business in Sydney (actually a suburb called Five Docks), Australia. He has recently turned over the management of the plumbing business to an employee, and is spending a lot more time with the various websites. In fact, Loz deleted a response from Sylvan to this very post because of the insults it contained.
Sylvan’s response did appear for a short period of time, but that is because of the time difference between Australia, and New York City.
Well, this post is beginning to be as verbose as one that Sylvan would write, but certainly is more grammatically correct. Have a good day, and
“Illigitimi Non Carborundum”.
(Don’t let the bastard wear you down) JWA
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Hello all
Just though I would reply to some of the comments above about this Board as I don’t think that most pepole out there realise how much work and cost goes behind the scenes into this site to keep it online.I have asked a number of plumbers and others out there, on numerous occasions, to help me with policing this site from time to time but like all things everyone out there is happy to let the next bloke do it as they are to busy.
Having said that I do accept full responsibility for this site and I do my best with the limited resources I have available to me. My appologies if that is not good enough.
I have spoken to Slyvan and he has a lot of passion for our plumbing industry and yes I do agree that sometimes he does go over the top but I would like to think some of the information that he has given has been helpfull to the public.
Thank you and I will be monitering the Board more carefully. However, I do not see them until after they have been posted and that may be the following day (time zone differences) and then I have only 1 to 2 hours to scan through between 150 to 200 emails each day.
Are there any volunteers out there who would be prepared to help?
Regards Lorenzo
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Bob said he would be glad to help.I don’t know though,his monitoring may be a little biased.
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quote:
Originally posted by Marty:
Short message to Sylvan:
My previous post will probably fall onto deaf ears, Sylvan. Sir,there’s no doubt that you do know your stuff. I’m sure, in person, your probably a nice guy. You may even have a wife and kids who love you and even a dog that likes you. Would it be so hard for you to be a “Mensch”(a man) once in awhile, instead of a “Schmuk” all the time?? No reply is necessary, just consider it. Marty
Hey SCHMUCK if you use a word please make sure you know its meaning “Mensch” = HUMAN BEING
Nice guy, leading a good life, someone to look up to.
DAT BE ME alright
I never listen to ditch diggers as I use them as mules UNSKILLED DRECK
I have nothing but contempt for “incompetence” no matter what the field.
If your going to do “plumbing” for example WHY shouldn’t a home owner have the same Quality as a commercial account?
You must know where some of these misfits come from.
For example the ditch digger uses the worst materials as he just doesn’t care,
as he stated several of times.24 years and he still has the Qualifications as a stumble bum If that much.
When an idiot posts that 3/8 rod is “only for commercial use” this tells you this slug is never going to be a “plumber”
These misfits who use “band Iron” are the get in get out mentality and screw the poor folks who trusted their judgment.
Band iron will rust, Band Iron will not hold weight compared to a proper job of clevis hangers and rod.
I yet to hear any home owner say “please install garbage in my home”
Wall is the worst of the bunch saying he is a “plumber” as He in my opinion is a non skilled slug who is going to do more damage in a home than any helper could imagine.
Wall has no clue to codes or good plumbing practices.
The ditch digger admits he has NO EDUCATION other then what he hears a professional tells him.
Unfortunately the ditch digger is the normal in what is happening to a once proud profession.
I know of several really Qualified septic tank installers.
Unfortunately John can never be considered one of them in my humble professional opinion.
A stumble bum by any other name is still a stumble bum.
John prays upon the unknowing in 3rd world countries or the boon docks.
These trades have enough slime in it and more and more are floating to the surface everyday.
I still cannot understand WHY a commercial account is entitled to a safer system then a residential dwelling?
I would like to know if this Wall ever even cracked open ANY book or code relating to plumbing Or heating?
Thankfully home centers are going to start installing plumbing and then the home owners will have a chance of having a SAFE plumbing systems installed.
Loz has allowed non licensed plumbers to give advice on this board.
John is not even a professional In
any field let alone plumbing Or drainage or even doing a proper installation of putting a tank in the ground.To bad Loz doesn’t have the folks on here take a basic 3rd year apprentice test before allowing them to give advice.
John would be on the UN employable lines and possibly face criminal charges in burying TOXIC waste under ground if Green peace has a say in his lack of consideration for the next generation.
Most of the “decent” septic tank installers not only design their own but make then with materials non toxic to the environment.
I am curious if these folks who refuse to give QUALITY to “residential” accounts offer a discount as they are figuring on using GARBAGE in these installations?
When a real dummy says 3/8 rod which cost less then 50 cents a foot is too good for the average home owner then why bother using anything but tie wire at 2 cents per mile
Hey JERK why not use garden hose for water supply?
Amazing how these misfits of society can tell folks what they can and can not afford
Could anyone imagine “John the trench man” selling cars?
I can see it now. Hey you cant afford a car with seat belts and air bags so take this one as THIS is what you need.
Most of my clients realize Quality pays and you get what you pay for.
Installing a plastic tank/piping under ground because you lack the ability to design a proper system is one thing as no one can fault a John for being stupid BUT knowing there are better systems out there and not even giving folks the option is a disgrace.
I love to educate my accounts and let them help in the decision making.
Giving OPTIONS is a marvelous thing. Giving Quality is WHY we are licensed and so called “professionals” (D D this lets you out on both accounts HUH?)
LOZ have a great one, I am starting my own list called Stumblebums and am asking John to be come Chairman of the board SHALOM
[Edited by SylvanLMP on 15 March 2001]
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Hey SYlvan.John said you told a customer to use a steel septic tank.I said no way!!Not a pro like Sylvan.Come on Sylvan say it ain’t so!!
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INCOMPETANT FOOLS!!! The truth of the matter is Sylvan Tieger along with only a few other posters on this board are competant enough to merit any recognition at all. The responses I have seen by some of the preceeding “plumbers” (and I’m being very generous with that word), are more often than not an embarrassment to the trade! In fact a few of the responses which were way out in left field I printed out and brought in to the Northern Alberta Institute of Technology and posted on the board. It was an excellent demonstration of what NOT to do, and pretty damned funny to boot. LMAO. My point being, anyone can be a plumber, but few and far between are the true tradesmen of this profession. Sylvan is one, most of you I’m sorry to say are wannabe’s with good penmanship….. I am a firm believer of non-compromise quality and safety, as most true professionnals are. The moment we as plumbers start compromising our workmanship we begin compromising our integrity. And if you are a businessman that can’t sell quality ….. well, I suggest you take some courses on marketing management along with some obvious needed upgrades in your trade. I only wish there were more peaple like Sylvan on here willing to share their knowledge so freely. Lorenzo has done a great job with this board, but maybe there should be a section reserved for plumbers only, to banter back and forth to our hearts content.
I know how frustrating it can be to read some of the nonsense on here. No blame to the owners or moderaters, I barely have enough time to read all the posts let alone respond to them. So hats off to all of you who do make the time to respond, wannabe’s and guru’s included. Sometimes the lamest posts can be the most amusing….but then again I’m not a homeowner seeking advice.Frank Hiebert
4th yr apprentice
Edmonton, Alberta
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