Flexible 1/2″ gas hoses

Yes, I have to agree that you have missed just about everything there is to know about that gas line.

You seem to be describing a flexible LP gas connection line. As this line of work and repair is the most dangerous threat to life and limb known to a homeowner; I suggest you go to the harware and tell them to give you a full course on all you need to know about gas connection and product safety. A 2-year full-time course on piping skills, proper tools, safety procedure, with full explanation of the NFPA codes, plumbing codes, and firemanship should get you up to speed on the minimum you need to know to assure your safety. The hardware salesman might be able to teach the course to you at no cost.

Alternatively, you could leave the most dangerous work you will ever attempt to a licensed professional.

Our hardware sells flexible-mesh-covered 1/2″ gas hosing in various lengths, with rotating female ends and “rounded nipple” inside each such end. These hoses come supplied with one male-male (1/2″) connector. INTERNALLY, this connector has one end tapering in and the other plain. It would seem that the hose attaches to the tapered end but even when tight-home the hose can rotate easily and surely must leak. Am I missing something about how these work ?

quote:

---

Originally posted by Harold Kestenholz:
Yes, I have to agree that you have missed just about everything there is to know about that gas line.

You seem to be describing a flexible LP gas connection line. As this line of work and repair is the most dangerous threat to life and limb known to a homeowner; I suggest you go to the harware and tell them to give you a full course on all you need to know about gas connection and product safety. A 2-year full-time course on piping skills, proper tools, safety procedure, with full explanation of the NFPA codes, plumbing codes, and firemanship should get you up to speed on the minimum you need to know to assure your safety. The hardware salesman might be able to teach the course to you at no cost.

Alternatively, you could leave the most dangerous work you will ever attempt to a licensed professional.

---

[kenseton] Dear Harold,
Your recommendation to seek professional assistance is very good advice. There are so many idiots around who rush into any job without first establishing a basic and clear understanding of the task and techniques at hand. And I realise you only seek to ensure safety in such matters, as you should.

Unfortunately my experience todate has been of contractors who have extended the work, made basic errors and mistakes, supplied inelegant and slovenly craftmanship, given evasive answers to simple questions and left a complete mess and expensive additional recovery work without apology. So please forgive me for thinking that my own standards of understanding, approach and planning for a task may be more to my liking.

Still, I was planning to call in another gasfitter. But I assume that does not stop me trying to understand how all these things work.

PS: The hardware says these hoses are for gas appliances. Personally I guess the hose goes in the plain end of the connector because that forces compression, but I was interested to hear the explanation of how these “rotating” joints seal.

PPS: Perhaps I misunderstand this web site. Are there not even simple “technical” questions that can be asked here ?

Yes, but there are some people who would like to make even the simplest plumbing job a major operation. In that context they will supply irrevlevent, but very verbose, answers to even the simplest question in the hope of so confusing the user, or alternatively convincing them that their life and limb are at risk, that they will never even attempt to perform repairs themselves. We have had these types of plumbers in our area. They go into an attic with a bottle of water and then spray it onto a pipe. Then they call the homeowner to look into the attic and see the “leaking pipe” for themselves. Then they impress the owner that the pipe is about to break and unless they start repiping immediately, they are going to have a major flood.

kenseton; you are welcome to ask any question on this forum. This gas line question is not a simple one. You would need an extensive explanation to understand that the product sold at your hardware is not for general use on any gas. I prefer to direct you to a professional for this use; for the reasons you agree upon.

It is unfortunate that you have not found a competent professional heating plumber; but do seek one by asking plumbers and plumbing suppliers in your area. fourth-year is welcome to give you any pertinent advice along with his criticisms.

I’d have to side with Harold on this one… basically if you have to ask then don’t proceed!
If you have the confidence and expertise to to the job then cover all the bases BEFORE you start the job. The best place to start is with the purveyor (ie: the gas company) since most locales will require an inspection anyway.
The nature of the material being handled (natural gas, LPG) is such that you not only risk injury and death to yourself but to any neighbour and bystander within at least a city block radius!
Too bad that a few unscrupulous “contractors” can marr the integrity of so many professionals.

I have seen hoses with swivel ends used mainly for commercial kitchen appliances however they are clearly marked for their use, they cannot be installed alone without substantial alteration to the piping system and appliance, and their use is restricted to certain applications only.

Btw, they are not available at any hardware store.

There are many rules and safety issues here and I am one of the first to say that not all are qualified enough to understand their use or restrictions. One of my suppliers asked me about the strange size of one of the hoses. When I showed him what the code said he said Gee your the first that could tell me why. Then he said gee I better get in safety chain to sell with it (he saw that in the code too)

The best Advice is get a Qualified Experianced Licenced Gasfitter

Michael the gasman http://www.burngas.com

Thank you for your approbation. My criticism was not directed to the need for using proper devices or the prudency of having a qualified person install them. Mine was in answer to his question as to why it was felt necessary to belittle a user who had a legimate question. If someone is going to thought an idiot for asking a logical question, then others are not going to place themselves in the position lf being ridiculed and will instead proceed with their original intents without getting our advice as to the wisdom of so doing. Thus we negate the original intent of this area by repelling honest seekers of truth.

quote:

---

Originally posted by fourth year:
Yes, but there are some people who would like to make even the simplest plumbing job a major operation. In that context they will supply irrevlevent, but very verbose, answers to even the simplest question in the hope of so confusing the user, or alternatively convincing them that their life and limb are at risk, that they will never even attempt to perform repairs themselves. We have had these types of plumbers in our area. They go into an attic with a bottle of water and then spray it onto a pipe. Then they call the homeowner to look into the attic and see the “leaking pipe” for themselves. Then they impress the owner that the pipe is about to break and unless they start repiping immediately, they are going to have a major flood.

---

Yup SURE SOUNDS like a GOOD UNION EMPLOYEE HERE HUH?
His other posting was how much a contractor is entitled to make NOW he talks about how “plumbers” rip off accounts.

This kid is getting some education I hope his union is proud of him

Ken: Your question was a good one, and deserves an equally good answer
Most Gasfitters that have spent any time in the trade can tell you stories that will give you bad dreams for years.
Charred remains of innocent kids that had a lifetime in front of them before a well intentioned Dad.
..neighbor..or just someone acting
out a do it your self project that went terribly wrong.
No one sets out to make an appearence on the 11 O’clock or to
be directly responsible for a fire
or explosion that can easily cause
great emotional and physical damage
Everyone does not possess the same measure mechanical or intellectual abilities.
You were obviously curious about
the flex connector gotten from your
hardware vendor. Suppose you had lacked that discernment related to
how it was going to function as you stated? What would have been the outcome had you installed a gas
connector that was leaking enough gas to trigger a fire or explosion?
I am probably the oldest active gasfitter in the Solar System, and
I have seen what a simple mistake or error in judgement can do.
In Clakesville, Tennessee in 1954
a personal friend who hooked up a gas heater in a mobile home was responsible for the death of his wife and three daughters from Carbon MonOxide poisoning in that mobile home. The Father of that family was away on manuvers with the 11th Airborne Division in Ft. Rucker Alabama when the tragedy occured. He became so depressed over the incident that he committed suicide on Christmas Eve of that same year.
Most gasfitters are caring folks
that are reluctent to give advice to someone who may or may not have good judgement..a mechanical apptitude..experience or the tools to do even the simplest chore.
I feel that you are entitled to a rational and humanitarian answer to your question.
Merry Christmas, and a Happy New Year.
Akmed

quote:

---

Originally posted by Akmed:
Ken: Your question was a good one, and deserves an equally good answer
Most Gasfitters that have spent any time in the trade can tell you stories that will give you bad dreams for years.
Charred remains of innocent kids that had a lifetime in front of them before a well intentioned Dad.
..neighbor..or just someone acting
out a do it your self project that went terribly wrong.
No one sets out to make an appearence on the 11 O’clock or to
be directly responsible for a fire
or explosion that can easily cause
great emotional and physical damage
Everyone does not possess the same measure mechanical or intellectual abilities.
You were obviously curious about
the flex connector gotten from your
hardware vendor. Suppose you had lacked that discernment related to
how it was going to function as you stated? What would have been the outcome had you installed a gas
connector that was leaking enough gas to trigger a fire or explosion?
I am probably the oldest active gasfitter in the Solar System, and
I have seen what a simple mistake or error in judgement can do.
In Clakesville, Tennessee in 1954
a personal friend who hooked up a gas heater in a mobile home was responsible for the death of his wife and three daughters from Carbon MonOxide poisoning in that mobile home. The Father of that family was away on manuvers with the 11th Airborne Division in Ft. Rucker Alabama when the tragedy occured. He became so depressed over the incident that he committed suicide on Christmas Eve of that same year.
Most gasfitters are caring folks
that are reluctent to give advice to someone who may or may not have good judgement..a mechanical apptitude..experience or the tools to do even the simplest chore.
I feel that you are entitled to a rational and humanitarian answer to your question.
Merry Christmas, and a Happy New Year.
Akmed

---

Thankyou for your rational answer to the question I have asked.
And you have a happy and safe Christmas too.

[Edited by kenseton on 15 December 2000]

quote:

---

Originally posted by fourth year:
Thank you for your approbation. My criticism was not directed to the need for using proper devices or the prudency of having a qualified person install them. Mine was in answer to his question as to why it was felt necessary to belittle a user who had a legimate question. If someone is going to thought an idiot for asking a logical question, then others are not going to place themselves in the position lf being ridiculed and will instead proceed with their original intents without getting our advice as to the wisdom of so doing. Thus we negate the original intent of this area by repelling honest seekers of truth.

---

Thankyou Fourth Year but I am afraid I have indeed misjudged the intent of this site. We all have safety and care uppermost in mind. Personally, I believe a good engineer, a good tradesman (whether it be a brickie, electician, plumber or any other) is the salt of the earth – but asking questions just seems to bring out a real knee-jerk in some people. In fact a “closure” posting I sent many weeks ago didn’t even get posted because it probably seemed to contain some negative reflection on the trade. Or am I being paranoid ? Perhaps my posting got lost.

Anyway, keep plumbing and take care all. Have a safe and happy Christmas. I consider this closure.

Ken Seton

Ken, you have to realize (though I’m sure you do since you seem intelligent) that some things can not be “dummied down” to the level required of the average homeowner. For example, when I do water quality testing, some clients ask how I test for calcium. Its not that simple to explain a cheleometric titration using EDTA and Erichrome black T to someone with no chemistry knowledge. Plumbing, like any profession carries with it its own terminology. Since most of my work is for plumbing contractors, I learned to communicate with them about what they need. There are so-called water analysts that use simple dip tests to check water for contaminants. This is akin to a plumber using inferior materials to do a job. It doesn’t work, and shows up at some point. I think Harold gave the best advice on this topic. Come to think of it, I NEVER seen him give bad advice. You would do well to pick his brain, and follow his ideas.
As for 4th year helper, uh, I won’t even go there. I just hope he gets you coffee the way you want it.

The Friendly Chemist
[Edited by Richard on 19 December 2000]